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	<title>Comments on: An Urban Vision for LRT</title>
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	<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/</link>
	<description>Edmonton City Councillor, Ward 10</description>
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		<title>By: lesoteric</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-9155</link>
		<dc:creator>lesoteric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Oct 2010 22:16:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-9155</guid>
		<description>Excellent post, great ideas and concept. I may have judged too harshly based on the LEGO post.

TOD hasn&#039;t been a resounding success in many places (Edmonton included) however some of that is a cultural or social issue. It is my belief that many of the passengers of LRT/ETS in Edmonton use it strictly to commute from home to work and nothing more. Thus TOD is nearly impossible in it&#039;s most efficient forms because many of the potential riders (home owners rather than renters) drive the type of development around transit and ask for low density or car parking so they can continue to maintain a suburban type lifestyle with the advantage of transit to get to work.

(I read the post on Park and Ride) I believe that the city needs to take a brave step and say NO to &#039;park and ride&#039; at Century Park and other LRT stations and encourage development of affordable properties nearby, not parking lots.  In fact placing a parking structure across the street from the housing (Century Park example) and developing more high density residential with street (or sidewalk) level commercial alongside or incorporating the actual LRT station might actually help grow the area as a neighborhood, get people on the streets (or sidewalks) and help that commercial remain viable and 
the residential remain safe, affordable, and accessible. It doesn&#039;t matter how much or little parking costs, it is still a parking lot and people can&#039;t pay any amount of money to live that close to transit unless there is housing there.

regarding the Ainlay stop - I spoke to an ETS planner and he basically restated the case that they can&#039;t justify a stop which only serves one small population and only for a very limited amount of time (school days, between 8 and 4, ~200 days a year). Perhaps pedestrian bridges to the Southgate stop would be a good compromise.

Anyways, you&#039;re pretty convincing with the why of low floor systems, it does seem to complement the type of compact development which is more desirable for the City of Edmonton.

Congrats on being re-elected, have a great term, keep blogging.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent post, great ideas and concept. I may have judged too harshly based on the LEGO post.</p>
<p>TOD hasn&#8217;t been a resounding success in many places (Edmonton included) however some of that is a cultural or social issue. It is my belief that many of the passengers of LRT/ETS in Edmonton use it strictly to commute from home to work and nothing more. Thus TOD is nearly impossible in it&#8217;s most efficient forms because many of the potential riders (home owners rather than renters) drive the type of development around transit and ask for low density or car parking so they can continue to maintain a suburban type lifestyle with the advantage of transit to get to work.</p>
<p>(I read the post on Park and Ride) I believe that the city needs to take a brave step and say NO to &#8216;park and ride&#8217; at Century Park and other LRT stations and encourage development of affordable properties nearby, not parking lots.  In fact placing a parking structure across the street from the housing (Century Park example) and developing more high density residential with street (or sidewalk) level commercial alongside or incorporating the actual LRT station might actually help grow the area as a neighborhood, get people on the streets (or sidewalks) and help that commercial remain viable and<br />
the residential remain safe, affordable, and accessible. It doesn&#8217;t matter how much or little parking costs, it is still a parking lot and people can&#8217;t pay any amount of money to live that close to transit unless there is housing there.</p>
<p>regarding the Ainlay stop &#8211; I spoke to an ETS planner and he basically restated the case that they can&#8217;t justify a stop which only serves one small population and only for a very limited amount of time (school days, between 8 and 4, ~200 days a year). Perhaps pedestrian bridges to the Southgate stop would be a good compromise.</p>
<p>Anyways, you&#8217;re pretty convincing with the why of low floor systems, it does seem to complement the type of compact development which is more desirable for the City of Edmonton.</p>
<p>Congrats on being re-elected, have a great term, keep blogging.</p>
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		<title>By: Station Around 40th Avenue Should be Revisited — Don Iveson</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-8927</link>
		<dc:creator>Station Around 40th Avenue Should be Revisited — Don Iveson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Oct 2010 00:23:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-8927</guid>
		<description>[...] the city&#8217;s philosophy on LRT has shifted considerably in the last 18 months. I wrote previously about the new &#8216;urban vision&#8217; for LRT, but in essence it means stopping a bit more [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the city&#8217;s philosophy on LRT has shifted considerably in the last 18 months. I wrote previously about the new &#8216;urban vision&#8217; for LRT, but in essence it means stopping a bit more [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Don Iveson :: Edmonton City Councillor, Ward 5</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-2763</link>
		<dc:creator>Don Iveson :: Edmonton City Councillor, Ward 5</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 19:27:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-2763</guid>
		<description>[...] what&#8217;s changed? I&#8217;ve written about the &#8216;urban&#8217; shift previously here, but as far as it applies to West LRT initially 87 Ave was a single leg, not part of a whole [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] what&#8217;s changed? I&#8217;ve written about the &#8216;urban&#8217; shift previously here, but as far as it applies to West LRT initially 87 Ave was a single leg, not part of a whole [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Don Iveson :: Edmonton City Councillor, Ward 5</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-2448</link>
		<dc:creator>Don Iveson :: Edmonton City Councillor, Ward 5</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 07:57:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-2448</guid>
		<description>[...] This map (prepared by consultants Steer Davies Gleave) has roots in earlier decisions Council gave with respect to the overall LRT Network Plan as well as the &#8216;Urban Style&#8217; system coommitment of more frequent stops, and low-floor technology (I wrote about these previously here). [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This map (prepared by consultants Steer Davies Gleave) has roots in earlier decisions Council gave with respect to the overall LRT Network Plan as well as the &#8216;Urban Style&#8217; system coommitment of more frequent stops, and low-floor technology (I wrote about these previously here). [...]</p>
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		<title>By: don</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-487</link>
		<dc:creator>don</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 23:06:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-487</guid>
		<description>John, my reading of the central area circulation notion is different than yours. The text and the consultant presentation focused on connecting the lines. It does not prescribe all the lines on the map, just illustrates some of the different ways you could achieve a crisscrossing triangle rather than relying on downtown to be the hub for all the lines. Central area circulation just means seeing whether there&#039;s a way to link the SE and SW lines down Whyte. This could tie in to an eventual East line out to Sherwood Park and/or an 87th Ave alignment for Westbound. Or it could just connect from U of A to Bonnie Doon, possibly as a Tram system, but certainly as a bus in the interim to establish the pattern of travel. Circulation refers to the ability to circulate as a passenger, not necessarily having a loop superimposed on all the other lines.

So there&#039;s no guarantee of any additional bridges. Other route selection would drive that decision, I think. And if there are bridges, we can sill tunnel down to a mid-height crossing, so it&#039;s not automatic that they would be high viaducts, though from a pedestrian and cycling use perspective that has merit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John, my reading of the central area circulation notion is different than yours. The text and the consultant presentation focused on connecting the lines. It does not prescribe all the lines on the map, just illustrates some of the different ways you could achieve a crisscrossing triangle rather than relying on downtown to be the hub for all the lines. Central area circulation just means seeing whether there&#8217;s a way to link the SE and SW lines down Whyte. This could tie in to an eventual East line out to Sherwood Park and/or an 87th Ave alignment for Westbound. Or it could just connect from U of A to Bonnie Doon, possibly as a Tram system, but certainly as a bus in the interim to establish the pattern of travel. Circulation refers to the ability to circulate as a passenger, not necessarily having a loop superimposed on all the other lines.</p>
<p>So there&#8217;s no guarantee of any additional bridges. Other route selection would drive that decision, I think. And if there are bridges, we can sill tunnel down to a mid-height crossing, so it&#8217;s not automatic that they would be high viaducts, though from a pedestrian and cycling use perspective that has merit.</p>
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		<title>By: John Kolkman</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-442</link>
		<dc:creator>John Kolkman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 18:14:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-442</guid>
		<description>Don,if the map above is anything to go by the proposed Central Area Circulation would be environmentally destructive as it would require two new crossings of the North Saskatchewan River Valley. The bridges would have to rival the height of the High Level Bridge if the lines are at street level. Such a circulation area would also create traffic chaos, and safety issues for pedestrians and cyclists, throughout the Downtown and Whyte Avenue areas.

Central Area Circulation via a tram (it’s not really LRT because it’s not rapid transit) is also completely unnecessary and redundant. Already in place is the underground LRT tunnel connecting the highest density zones in the central area (i.e. the University/Health Sciences area, the Legislature/Government Centre area, and the Downtown core).  Once the NAIT line is completed there will be further connections to MacEwan College, the Royal Alex and NAIT.  To complete the circulation, the #7 bus already connects the Churchill and Central LRT stations via Scona Road and Whyte Avenue to University Station with a 15 minute frequency during peak periods.  I’m sure bus service frequency could be increased if warranted by passenger demand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don,if the map above is anything to go by the proposed Central Area Circulation would be environmentally destructive as it would require two new crossings of the North Saskatchewan River Valley. The bridges would have to rival the height of the High Level Bridge if the lines are at street level. Such a circulation area would also create traffic chaos, and safety issues for pedestrians and cyclists, throughout the Downtown and Whyte Avenue areas.</p>
<p>Central Area Circulation via a tram (it’s not really LRT because it’s not rapid transit) is also completely unnecessary and redundant. Already in place is the underground LRT tunnel connecting the highest density zones in the central area (i.e. the University/Health Sciences area, the Legislature/Government Centre area, and the Downtown core).  Once the NAIT line is completed there will be further connections to MacEwan College, the Royal Alex and NAIT.  To complete the circulation, the #7 bus already connects the Churchill and Central LRT stations via Scona Road and Whyte Avenue to University Station with a 15 minute frequency during peak periods.  I’m sure bus service frequency could be increased if warranted by passenger demand.</p>
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		<title>By: don</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-199</link>
		<dc:creator>don</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 16:04:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-199</guid>
		<description>Good tip, Jim. I was doing this and then got out of the habit. Will get back into it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good tip, Jim. I was doing this and then got out of the habit. Will get back into it.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-198</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 15:36:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-198</guid>
		<description>I would suggest that your links open in another page. I tried to access two links off of this page to not have them open at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would suggest that your links open in another page. I tried to access two links off of this page to not have them open at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-182</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 06:20:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-182</guid>
		<description>this is my number one concern for edmonton.

it touches on almost all other major issues this city faces. urban sprawl, transportation, environment, urban revitalization, poverty, ect.

please make sure we don&#039;t see public transit be ignored ever again in this city... it&#039;s about time this city starts acting like a city, and stops pretending to be a big town</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this is my number one concern for edmonton.</p>
<p>it touches on almost all other major issues this city faces. urban sprawl, transportation, environment, urban revitalization, poverty, ect.</p>
<p>please make sure we don&#8217;t see public transit be ignored ever again in this city&#8230; it&#8217;s about time this city starts acting like a city, and stops pretending to be a big town</p>
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		<title>By: don</title>
		<link>http://www.doniveson.ca/2009/05/24/an-urban-vision-for-lrt/comment-page-1/#comment-176</link>
		<dc:creator>don</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 07:30:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.doniveson.ca/?p=385#comment-176</guid>
		<description>Brent, I didn&#039;t say we shouldn&#039;t connect something to the International Airport, just that our LRT system might not be the best link out there. Ask yourself: would you rather take a fast train and transfer to the LRT half way or take a slower train the whole way? The answer might well be the slower train, but if the cost to the public and/or the rider was several times higher for the slower single train, which would you pick?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brent, I didn&#8217;t say we shouldn&#8217;t connect something to the International Airport, just that our LRT system might not be the best link out there. Ask yourself: would you rather take a fast train and transfer to the LRT half way or take a slower train the whole way? The answer might well be the slower train, but if the cost to the public and/or the rider was several times higher for the slower single train, which would you pick?</p>
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